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Photo by Julia Kupiec

After wrapping up the debut album chapter of her life, singer-songwriter Sabrina Song let the unknown write the next path. The winding road happened to arrive at Big Trick, a collection of six songs that weren’t supposed to live as one, but naturally found their purpose together. We chatted with Song about flipping the internal nature of her previous record, allowing collaboration to flow freely, and everything that led to the kismet creation of her newest offering: 

OnesToWatch: You released your debut album, You Could Stay In One Spot, and I’d Love You The Same, almost 2 years ago. What did you learn from that process?

Sabrina Song: I learned so much from making it. Up until then, everything was fully self-produced and written just by me. The album was the first time I worked with a co-producer across the whole thing. There were a lot of live elements, which I had to learn how to communicate instead of doing everything with my own hands. How do I want the drums to sound? How should I instruct this instrumentalist? I was putting a lot of pressure on myself to fully realize the vision and I'm so proud of how the album came out. Once it was all done, I was more willing to experiment and play. I knew I probably wasn't going to do another full-length album right away, so I tried to say yes more and didn't feel the need to prove myself as a producer. I used to feel that if I didn't do everything alone, people were gonna think I wasn't actually doing anything. I’m in a more secure spot now. Half of this project ended up being work with other producers and writers. That was really new, but still felt super me. It just had to be the right people. This time it was more about capturing other parts of my personality and infusing it into the music, since a lot of my music's been very serious.

You can definitely hear that in the new music. Was there a lot of pressure making your first album? 

Of course. I mean, you only do your first album once and I received a grant, so I was on a timeline. I felt a lot of pressure for things to feel cohesive from start to finish. I wanted to make sure I was checking all the boxes and musically, that it felt fulfilling. Once my first album was finished, I was just making songs that I liked. When you listen to them all together, you realize there’s a common theme. For Big Trick, there were no expectations, whereas a lot of the songs on the album came with the heaviness of being for the album. 

I haven't spoken to a lot of artists in the US that have gotten grants to make music. That’s an amazing thing. 

It was through the New York Foundation for the Arts, the women's fund specifically. That completely made it possible. I felt a pressure to really make the most of it and use it right. I felt honored and like it was my chance to make this happen independently. At the time, the structure of making it all with one person was so helpful, because it would have been so overwhelming doing it piecemeal with different people. After that, I thought ‘Why don't I just make songs I'm excited about?’ It didn't start to take shape of a project until a little bit further down the line. 

Did it take a while to find the right people to work with? One thing artists always talk to me about is how weird session culture is.

What's funny is I do a lot of sessions as a writer and producer, so I'm usually in the room as the artist. I totally get that. You meet someone and it's like, ‘What horrible thing happened to you? Do you want to write about it?’ And then we all workshop it together. When people reach out to me for sessions for my artist project, I don’t say yes to everything because I'm very particular and I'm not someone who can write on the fly. I tend to write the song first and then produce it out, at least when I’m making music alone. But, all of the songs on this EP that have collaborators were from sessions. “Play It Cool” was from Greer Baxter setting up a session I thought we were doing for someone else. We got there and she was like, ‘Oh, we thought we were doing it for you.’ So I thought, since we’re already here, let's just do it for me. We ended up absolutely loving the song, but it wasn't even on purpose. Same with “Background Actor”, which I wrote with Cody Fitzgerald and my friend Emma Botti, who is the main person I've co-written with. It really is about the right moment with the right people. There’s always a kismet factor. I’m happy that I let myself be more open and let go of the reins a little. The people I work with are so talented and it’s been a relief to not feel like I have to do everything alone. The other half of the EP are songs I did alone, which of course feel the closest to my chest.

It’s cool that those songs might not have existed if you went into the session thinking they were going to be for you. 

Totally. A lot of happy accidents. 

Have you been writing songs forever? What was your entry point? 

I was always singing, playing the piano and guitar. I played violin at school and did choir, but it was very performance based. I was posting covers on YouTube and all of that. When I think back on it, it’s because I’m such a perfectionist and was afraid to be bad at it. That’s why I stuck to covers at first. I started songwriting in high school and producing in college. That's when it became my main mode of expressing myself. I love producing. I love the writing process. I love world building. But, it was never something that just flowed out of me. It’s been a nice challenge to learn what I want my sound to be.

I love that story because the average response is something like, ‘I've been writing songs since I could talk.’ It’s such a real thing, to not try because it’s not going to be perfect from the start. 

Right. When you grow up covering other artists, you're also imitating their voice and their movement. It took until the last three-ish years for everything to finally feel mine. 

I'm sure it opens so much up in songwriting when you learn how to produce.

Totally. I used to write everything on piano, which was very lyric and melody driven. Now, there are some songs, like “Moving Target”, that started as an instrumental. That never used to happen. 

What was the process for choosing the singles? 

I knew I wanted to focus on “Background Actor” and “LOCK” as stand-alone tracks, even though in my head I thought they were probably the lead singles to a project. But the rest of the songs hadn't been written yet. I wanted to take my time on music videos for those. Now that I look at the tracklist as a whole, I would have totally picked those as the singles anyway. It was cool to almost fill out the answers and then flip over the paper to find the question, realizing I had already answered correctly.

It must be validating to realize how much you know your own work, even subconsciously. 

I know! There was a part of me that debated on them just being singles. I told myself if I don't feel as excited about the stuff that comes after and I'm not ready, maybe they'll just stand alone. I wanted to give them that much attention anyway, especially after wrapping up the album. But working on them inspired me so much, and I felt so excited that I didn’t want their journey to be over. Thematically, they totally fit with the songs that ended up finishing the story.

What is the process for making visuals for your music? 

I love music videos. I love watching them and I love making them. It’s the most stressful thing, because it’s the biggest labor of love. I don't think my strength is conceptualizing visuals and storyboarding, but I definitely know what I like. For both videos, I got to work with people for the first time who I'd been a fan of. They gave color to the world. I feel so lucky that people are willing to collaborate on videos specifically.  

“Moving Target” as a closer for this EP really hit me. I related to what you're talking about in that song and I'm sure so many people will too. How did you decide it would finish the project? 

Thank you. When I wrote the first line of that song, I was like ‘Ow’. There’s a self-critical aspect, but it also has a hopeful tone. It’s probably the most earnest song on Big Trick, that and “Broken Machine.” I wanted to end on “Moving Target” because it felt like the mission statement of this time in my life. Things might not look how you wanted, but it all comes back to the people around you. It was the only song that felt like it was finishing the project in the right way. It kind of feels like the credits are rolling a bit. It says everything that I was feeling at the time. 

Now that I know more about the process it hits even harder. Making this EP was almost like a moving target for you. 

It really was! Being creative is like going through a hallway, but you don't know where it leads. You just have to be okay with it being a “Moving Target”. I can't believe some people are in careers where they're like, ‘At this age, I will make this amount of money and I will have this degree at this time.’ I'm like, ‘I literally have no idea what's going to happen tomorrow. If I get a call, I will fly anywhere.’ You have to keep yourself open to do what feels true to you, even if you're not even sure where it's going. Your mid twenties is when people's paths are really diverging. That’s what I was feeling.

I'm about to turn twenty eight and I'm happy to be aware that the choices I’m making are going to set up my thirties. I might as well choose something I love.

Those are the emotions I felt after finishing this EP, but not in an overwhelming way. 

What were the sonic inspirations for the EP? 

I definitely have been listening to a lot of 90’s alternative. I love The Sundays, The Cranberries, Fiona Apple. I wanted the music to be singer-songwriter and alternative, but in a pop presentation. When I listen to Big Thief or Japanese Breakfast, it feels like songwriting was clearly the base that they built the song around. If you were to strip the song down, the bones are really strong. This project feels the most me. I don't feel like I wore my influences on my sleeve or anything, but knowing my taste, I really like where it landed. 

You're opening for Pom Pom Squad this weekend. How are you putting together the set? When's the last time you played a show? 

I opened for Alemeda earlier this year, who is going crazy viral right now. She’s great. I got to play some of the songs live for the first time. I'm also planning my EP release show that's gonna have an even bigger band, which is May 14th at Union Pool. So, I'm doing a tighter set opening for Pom Pom Squad, but I'm really excited. They’re so cool. I'm crafting both setlists at the same time.

I've met Alemeda, she's so cool and so nice. She’s amazing live.

Oh, yeah. Her voice is crazy. 

Who are your OnesToWatch?

I'm friends with the band Okay Cowgirl and they are so amazing. Talk about songwriting that has the strongest bones and the most amazing front woman. Her name is Leah and they're rolling out a new album right now. The first single is called “It Wasn’t You, It Was The Feeling.” Also, the band caring less from Philly. They have one EP out. I found them just from looking around on Discover Weekly and I am their biggest fan. Then, I would say my friend Georell Magno, who is a drummer. He's drummed for underscores and Juliet Ivy, but he recently released his solo debut EP called The Color After The Spark. 

Listen to Big Trick below: